Mastering Legal Marketing – Patricia Baxter – S4E15

Robert Hanna (00:00):

Welcome to the Legally Speaking Podcast. I’m your host, Rob Hanna. Today, I’m delighted to be joined by Patricia Baxter. Patricia is a managing partner at Morgan and Akins where she handles general litigation cases in Pennsylvania and New Jersey, particularly specializes in premises liability, product liability, and aviation. Tricia is also the creator of 60 Days to Clarity and ‘The Legal Navigator’ YouTube page, helping companies keep their litigation costs under control. She also recently published her first book, ‘The 25 Factors That Influence Liability and Damage in GL Files’, which became a number one release within 24 hours. Prior to this Patricia worked as a managing partner in the Philadelphia office of Cruiser and Mitchell, LLP. So a very, very warm welcome Patricia.

Patricia Baxter (00:50):

Hey Rob. Oh my God. That was a hell of an intro. I need, whoever writes your stuff, I need to talk to Them. That is beautiful. I love that.

Robert Hanna (01:00):

Well, we love you and thank you for coming on the show. And before we dive into all your amazing achievements and everything you’ve done for the legal community, we must start with our customary icebreaker question here on the Legally Speaking Podcast, which is: on the scale of 1 to 10, 10 being very real. How real would you rate the reality hit series ‘Suits’ in terms of its reality?

Patricia Baxter (01:26):

I actually never seen it. Well, I don’t even know what that’s about. What is it about?

Robert Hanna (01:29):

Its great that you’ve never seen it. Basically, most lawyers come on and they slate it. They say it’s sort of not real. It’s not the truth. It’s basically a bit of a Hollywood legal series, which isn’t very real. So people tend to just give it a very low figure, but the fact you’ve not seen it. I think we’ll move straight on. So let’s start at the beginning. Tell us a bit about your family background and upbringing.

Patricia Baxter (01:50):

Sure. So I was raised in Virginia by a single mom. We were sort of lower middle class. I’ve had a job since I was, I think, 10 years old babysitting. You know, I think the only year that I did not work was my first year in law school and I think they prohibited it, but I was, you know, raised in that environment that you work really hard. I saw my mom struggle with, you know, money and jobs and not loving what she did. She would come home and be miserable. And she taught me, she’s like, you do not want to do that. So she really pushed education. I went to college, I went to law school and I really thought I would get out of law school and help people. I looked at, you know, working at the DA’s office, the public defender’s office. I was really wanting to work at women’s organizations and I found out that the salaries were so low that I couldn’t pay my student loans and live and work there at the same time. So I ended up pivoting and going into private practice, the defense field. And that’s where I’ve been the past 23 years. That journey in of itself is five other podcast episodes, but it is been so cool. You know, it has been challenging where I’m at now is not where I thought I would’ve started from when I started, I had completely different objectives and goals in mind. So it’s been a crazy ride now I’m managing my office. Uh, and I run the Northeast division of my law firm and it’s one of the coolest things I’ve ever done. So I’m very lucky and grateful, um, for my position. So that’s kind of where I’m at.

Robert Hanna (03:31):

Absolutely. And you touched on it, there you are currently, the managing partner at Morgan & Akins. So just tell us a little bit more about day-to-day what that role entails, because yeah, it must be fascinating.

Patricia Baxter (03:42):

Yeah. When I started as managing partner, I was still doing the day-to-day litigation. I was still in depths. I was still trying cases. I was still doing ARBs writing reports. I was still doing all the day to day and over the past seven years, that has evolved. So the point where I’ve, I’ve hired more senior people, people that frankly are better at doing depths and ARBs and trials and reports, and I’ve sort of removed myself. I’ve done the work to figure out what I’m really good at and maybe what my weaknesses are. And I’ve sort of hired those people that their strengths are my weaknesses. So to build a team and create a team and I’ve stepped out of that day-to-day so right now, most of my day-to-day is marketing. I would say 70 to 80% is marketing. I have my client relationships. Uh, I’m very much though, the 30,000 foot view, we talk big ticket items, goals, where cases should go, how to get there, but they execute most of my team executes on that vision.

Patricia Baxter (04:45):

And it’s fascinating because I never considered myself a marketer or a networker. I didn’t love it. I thought it was like when I first started doing it was something that I had to do, but I didn’t love it. I’ve somehow grown to love it. So that’s my day, 80%. I’m on a lot of podcasts. We write a lot, I have my own podcast. I have my YouTube channel. We do a lot of video. We do a lot of outreach. So it’s right now, it’s about getting creative on our marketing efforts, especially when COVID hit last year. How do we continue to network and market? When all my speaking engagements were shut down, my dinners, my lunches, my happy hours, all that went away. And it’s been one of the coolest things to really try to get creative on your content and how you meet new people. So I’m still trying to tap into that creativity. Uh, I just finished a book and released it as you noted in your intro. And that was another way now I’m like, all right, what else, what else can we do next? So that’s my day to day is really networking and marketing. And then we do, I do a little bit of admin stuff, but that’s primarily it.

Robert Hanna (05:49):

And I’m so glad you said that, cause you’re doing a great job on the marketing and networking and I’m sure, and why we’re so keen to have you as a guest on our show is that’s the future right? And I think there’s still a lot of traditions with senior partners, managing partners to kind of, they’re not sure about, well, why should I go into that space? I’ve already got a reputation, you know, what do you say to that? Because you and I both know that content creation and it’s good for business and it, and you need to be visible online nowadays. But what would you say to people who are less resistant, who are still quite senior and refuse to perhaps embrace that new way of, of working basically a senior people in, within these law firms?

Patricia Baxter (06:24):

Yeah. I mean, I think if you just look around the world is changing. How we do business is changing, how people are consuming content is changing. If you’re still thinking that television ads are the way to go, I think you’re missing out on the world changing. So I think that’s the thing you have to think about how people consume information, how people find you. It has opened up so much on how that happens. There are multiple channels on how people find you. It’s not even just your website anymore. It’s not going and speaking, um, anymore really what’s driving information at this point is, is content, is creating value and then getting the other person’s attention. I mean, you’re competing for eyeballs, you’re competing for attention. So you have to really look at how the world is changing. If you’re still stuck in the nineties with just conferences, I think that they don’t ever go away, but to open up your mind to say, all right, people are consuming information differently. How do you reach those people? What are they doing? That’s I think such an interesting exercise. So that the answer, your question is just look around and then look at your strategy. Where’s your strategy coming from? Is it from the nineties? Is it from the eighties? It should be 2021 strategy. And it really does open up a world of creativity and allows people to access things, especially in the legal profession that they weren’t accessing before. So that’s my answer.

Robert Hanna (07:57):

I agree, completely agree. And I think you’re doing a fascinating and fantastic job with everything that you do. And I enjoy following all of your content. In terms of the pandemic you know, it has hit a lot of firms, it has had to be a lot of adapting. How have you found the firm has reacted to managing cases remotely during this time?

Patricia Baxter (08:14):

So we were kind of lucky. Like we had a culture in place that was paperless and that was not necessarily tied to an office setting. And I know there’s a significant number of firms in my area that were the same, but I did see the firms that weren’t ready for it. And I saw firms that had to completely shut down for the first several weeks of COVID because they didn’t have the infrastructure in place, but we did, we did have to pivot, like we did have to rethink about, all right, how are we meeting? How are we communicating if you’re all at home, culture and relationships are still important. So we did turn a lot to Zoom. Um, but it wasn’t as difficult as I have thought it would be. We had to set up admins at home. We had to set up paralegals at home.

Patricia Baxter (09:03):

That was definitely different. And I had, I challenged my issues of trust a little bit. Like I still had the old school trust issues with my admins. I’m like, are they going to work? If they’re at home and no one’s watching it. And they did. Of course they did. What was I thinking before COVID and they rose to the occasion. So it was actually minor tweaks for us is to say, how do we do this? How do we get, uh, you know, how do we sign? How do we do original signatures? How do we get like a court reporter stamp or, um, a notary stamp that those are minor stuff, but it was Zoom. It was email, it was phone calls and we just sort of adapted. It’s been, it’s been an interesting learning experience.

Robert Hanna (09:42):

Yeah. And obviously you’ve adapted very, very well. And another thing that we’ve touched on previously, but I want to talk about more, particularly as an expansion of content is your podcast – ‘The Defense Never Rests’. So what does it aim to do and where can people access it?

Patricia Baxter (09:57):

So yeah, we started ‘The Defense Never Rests’ probably about a year and a half ago. I think it was October of 2019 before, um, the pandemic hit and it had been a, an idea for like a year and a half. Like I sat on it for like a year and a half afraid, like I was like, what am I going to say? What is it going to be about? Are people actually going to listen? And then I just kind of smacked myself in the face and said, get off your butt, make it happen. We made it happen. And right now it is about really talking to the defense side of the bar. Lawyers, claims professionals, risk managers, general counsel on the issues that we see them struggle with the most. So it’s not always litigation focused. It can be work environment. It could be, you know, the balancing of family.

Patricia Baxter (10:45):

It could be your journey as a general counsel. It could be how you create a company during COVID like, there is such a broad range, but that’s the focus is the people on the defense side of litigation. What do they deal with? And, and can we deliver content that helps them with whatever they deal with, but in, in interesting entertaining, fun way, which I think you do really well. You’re not stuffy, you’re fun. You’re entertaining. And you know, when we first started the podcast, I didn’t want to get on and be like, you know, let’s talk about caseload. Smith v Jones says X, Y, and Z. You know, I wanted to have some fun and laugh. Cause that’s what I find when I’m in my client meetings, yeah, there’s work talk, but there’s also laughter people don’t want to take themselves too seriously. They want to have some fun. So I think if you can combine in a podcast giving value and having fun at the same time, what’s better than that? So that’s, that’s kind of what we’re about. You can find us on Apple, Spotify, SoundCloud, all of the major channels. Um, so definitely check us out if you’re inclined.

Robert Hanna (11:50):

And that’s what I love about you, Patricia, you’re so strategic because you mentioned earlier about how your clients and future clients and people in industry are consuming your content. You know, having a really good engaging, entertaining, but value add podcast is just another great vehicle you’re using to build your community and keep your community engaged. So I love what you’re doing. Okay. So you’re also the creator, as I mentioned at the Top 60 Days to Clarity. So tell our listeners what 60 days to Clarity is all about.

Patricia Baxter (12:18):

So yeah, this is my personal brand. You know, I’ve spent the past two years really doing the work to figure out what I do best. And this 60 days to clarity is the final output, which is my brand. And it is all about a litigation mindset. How do you look at your cases within the first 60 days to reach a conclusion, to figure out where they’re going, it’s about getting clarity about your goal. You know, most cases end with settlement, trial or a motion. You get out via motion. So let’s look at those exits, but let’s look at them within the first 60 days to see what’s right for you. And there’s a certain mindset there. You have to sort of let go of perfection. You have to engage and embrace assumptions. You have to really be okay with making some educated guesses based off experience and what you learn about the case, but it’s a mindset.

Patricia Baxter (13:12):

And then combined with a, how to. Here’s the mindset that’s necessary for you to evaluate your cases within the first 60 days so that you get the right information to make the right decisions. And once at the 60 to 75 day mark of the cases life, you should have an idea of where it’s headed. And if you don’t like where it’s headed, you get to change its direction. The one thing I found most of my clients, frustrated my clients the most was when their cases would just go on a path of just litigating them without a goal. And then you would get 10 months a year and a half, two years sometimes down the road, you spend a hundred grand and now you’re deciding to settle the case. Well, why hasn’t that discussion happened within the first 60 days? So that’s the brand. 60 Days to Clarity is about getting clarity within the first 60 days. I have a video that kind of walks through the, how to. I have a book that does an even deeper dive into the how to, because I think it’s really important. I see so many lawyers saying you can’t, you can’t get all the information that you need within the first 60 days. I’m like, yeah, you’re right. But you still can get enough of the right information to make a call and talk to your client about where their cases headed. So that’s, that’s my 60 Days to Clarity.

Robert Hanna (14:26):

Yeah and you described it so clearly. So I really appreciate you doing that. Okay. You’re also a best-selling author, but I read that you hadn’t always had a passion for reading and writing. So tell us a bit about that. And then when that changed for you.

Patricia Baxter (14:40):

I became a member of a, uh, online networking group, a female lawyer, online networking group, right at the start of the pandemic. And you know, the goal of this was really to help each others engagement. It was like a pod, if you will. And that group decided to write a book and I participated in writing a chapter and through that experience, I was like, wow, this is pretty cool. Right. And I helped on the pulling the writing together and on the publishing. And so I saw the, how to self publish, which wasn’t easy, but I’m like, it’s, it’s doable. So when I was trying to figure out, after I’d done my 60 days to clarity video, I had just finished authoring that book and it came out and I was like, I need to do something. That’s a little bit of a deeper dive into my 60 Days to Clarity.

Patricia Baxter (15:29):

What can I do? I thought about webinars. I thought about like PowerPoint presentations, nothing kind of sat. And I’m like, well, I just wrote a chapter in a book. Maybe I can write a book. It lets me do a little deeper dive. And I started writing it and I was like, this is actually pretty fun. Like this is kind of cool. So it was that journey that brought me there, not to say it didn’t have hiccups and twist and turn as all creative endeavors do. I was surprised at how much I liked it because I wasn’t a big reader when I was younger. I didn’t really enjoy books until I was in my forties and now I can’t get enough of them. But you know, for the first 40 years of my life, I wasn’t a big lover of reading. I wasn’t, um, a big lover of writing.

Patricia Baxter (16:10):

I did it for my job because I had to, but I never really loved it. And now I found myself loving it. So that was the, the journey. And it also taught me sometimes just showing up, like I just showed up for that book with the networking ladies. And I was just like, they said, let’s write a book who’s in? I’m like, yes, I’m in. And I just said yes to it, not really, really understanding where it would lead me. And it ended up leading me to writing this more self branded book. And it was a very cool experience.

Robert Hanna (16:41):

Yeah. And we’re going to talk more about your first book. So ‘The 25 Factors that Influence Liability and Damage in GL Files’, and that was recently published, as you mentioned, also released free as an ebook and it aims to show how you, the mindset and the steps necessary to evaluate your case early on. Even when you start with little or no information. So just tell us more about the book and again, sort of, you kind of touched on it, but any other sort of motivations behind kind of really wanting to get that out there.

Patricia Baxter (17:10):

The big chunk of the book is mindset. It is getting past this need of perfection and what kind of mindset can you adopt that lets you make decisions when you don’t have everything that you want. I think us lawyers are driven a little bit to perfection and have been wanting all. I need to have all the information before I can make a really sound smart, intelligent decision. And this book is about undoing that a little bit to say, you really don’t right. You really don’t need every single bit of information. You need certain pieces of information and for the stuff that you can’t get, you make assumptions about them. So it is sort of de-brainwashing, a little bit of what, at least how I was taught. I had to de-brainwash myself and de-brainwashing that and getting into the mindset and then how you do it.

Patricia Baxter (18:01):

So it is a step-by-step look. You get your case in. What’s the first thing that you do? Here are the questions that you ask yourself? Here’s what you need to find out. What is your venue look like? Do you have liens? What’s your, what are your injuries in this case? What are your treatment? Do you have that information? How do I get that information? Like one of the biggest things my clients want to see are what are the injuries and treatment? And you don’t always know that right off the bat, but you can usually pick up the phone and the plaintiff’s counsel will say, oh, this is, you know, a sprain and strain. It’s not a big case. Or we had a rotator cuff tear with surgery, or we have, you know, amputations or whatever it may be. You can get a feel for the injuries and treatment just by asking.

Patricia Baxter (18:44):

So this book is really for the big ticket factors, the 25 factors, I list them out. Here are the 25 factors that you should look at in every case to see if they’re prevalent. And if you can’t find them out, here’s some tips on how to do that. And then it circles back at the end. Now you have all this information about your case. What do you do with it? And I outline what you do with it and how you come to clarity, how you come to say, Hey, client a, this is your case. I think you should mediate. Or this is something we should file a motion for summary judgment on. Or this is a trial candidate because of X, Y, and Z. You get to have the end goal talk early on and that’s the goal. So that’s what the book helps you do, uh, by step-by-step process.

Robert Hanna (19:31):

Yeah. Brilliant. And it definitely sounds interesting. And I know you’ve put a lot of hard effort into that and you touched on it before, but you did contribute to ‘Network’, which is a number one bestseller, you know, the 20 chapter, you know, I’ve followed you written by 20 women lawyers born out of the pandemic, which is great. Can you tell us just about some of the other topics that are included within that particular book? Um, just if you would have a bit of a, a flavor and who are interested in maybe going and get a copy.

Patricia Baxter (19:57):

Yeah. I think that book is a collaboration. All of our individual’s stories, 20 lawyers who came together in this online LinkedIn networking group, we were a pod in the traditional sense of we helped boost each other’s engagement, but we also had very personal chats. You can talk about your law career, you can talk about your children. You can talk about your boob job. You could talk about anything that you wanted in that chat, no judgment people held space for you. And it was really nice to see that collaboration back and forth. So we wanted to capture that special dynamic in a book. And every woman really wrote the chapter from their own personal experience. For me, it was the journey the three years leading up to that pandemic and where I was at personally and professionally when the pandemic hit. And then what happened to the personal and professional dynamics once we started to get into COVID and how that affected my mindset, my career, my family, and what I did to sort of not fix it.

Patricia Baxter (21:00):

I don’t think anybody needs fixing, but help really hone in on what works for me. It’s a lot of these women sharing their personal struggles. There are issues. There were talks about issues of infertility and how that impacted their career to changing from big law, to coaching, to creating businesses. People created businesses during the pandemic and how they did that, how they got through some of the negative mindset that at least, I think I’m not that it’s, it’s only for women lawyers, but you do find it, I think a little bit more in women lawyers, that negative mindset or that, that I can do that. So the feedback that I’ve gotten from this book is that it is inspiring because the women are vulnerable. They don’t just talk about, oh, look at all the things that I’ve done. They talk about their struggles in getting there and how they overcame those struggles.

Patricia Baxter (21:49):

So if you’re struggling and where you’re at in your career, it’s a great book man or woman. I’ve had a ton of men reach out to me. I was surprised that I had a ton of men reach out to me and say, you know, I resonate with the fact that you said, I like to put my daughter on the bus every day. I resonate with that. And if you’re struggling with where you are, I think it’s a great book. It, because it shows 20 different perspectives on that very theme. So I highly recommended and all proceeds go to charity. So my promotion of the book is not putting anything in my pocket. So everything goes to, um, Women’s Legal Association charity in the states. So definitely pick it up.

Robert Hanna (22:27):

Yeah. Really well said. And I encourage all our listeners to do that for sure. And you and I both share a very good mutual friend in Shay Rowbottom, and you’ve been through her courses, as we know, she’s very big in LinkedIn world, particularly in video content creation. And I believe you’ve now developed your own courses. So can you explain a little bit more about what they entail or some of the things you get up to?

Patricia Baxter (22:49):

Well, I haven’t quite done the courses yet. I really kind of refer everyone to Shay, because I think, you know, her course changed my life personally, professionally coming across a woman who was so knowledgeable, um, and such great ways and really encouraged me to get out of my comfort zone and do things that I never thought we would do. So I love that we share that I love for, I’m still such a big fan of hers. Um, but I know that there are a ton, especially for lawyers, there are lawyer coaches out there that are creating content. Um, but I do get a lot of questions about it. So I do webinars on, on occasion with how to develop, use LinkedIn, to develop business, but who knows, maybe I’ll do a course one day. Well, we’ll see.

Robert Hanna (23:33):

Watch this space. And on the theme again, you also have your own YouTube channel, The Legal Navigator. So can you tell us a bit more about the content featured on that page?

Patricia Baxter (23:43):

So that is primarily our podcast videos. I have found that there are some sections of the podcast community that don’t just like audio. They like to see visually, you know, look at the podcast. So that’s primarily, it, it is also where my branded video sits. I’ve originally started it because I found like the LinkedIn videos would go away after a time. And I, you know, it’s not like you had a spot to go see what LinkedIn videos that you had. So I created a YouTube channel to have that central spot where I could show people like, oh, check out. We did a mediation podcast. Here’s the link to that mediation podcast. And I’ve had clients take those YouTube links and circulate them within their, within their companies. So it’s just a spot for me. My YouTube channel isn’t necessarily, I don’t care about growing it, but it houses my content in a evergreen kind of way that I can go back and always find it and reference it and use it again. So that’s sort of my purpose on that.

Robert Hanna (24:45):

Yeah, absolutely. So I wanted to ask your obviously managing partner, bestselling author achieved all of the success, but no one gets to the top without having a lot of knock-backs and a lot of tough points in their career. So what advice would you give to people probably being very inspired, listening to you today when you have had tough moments, tough times in your career, what would you say to others to kind of motivate them to keep going?

Patricia Baxter (25:09):

So I would say the tough times in my career have been when I’ve tried to do it alone and I try to DIY it, do it yourself it, and I would spin my wheels and the spinning of the wheels was like, I’m like, this is ridiculous. And the spinning of the wheels would leave me to have those thoughts of quitting or giving up or moving on. So I I’d made some strategic decisions to work with some coaches I worked with Shay. I was about to give up on my LinkedIn strategy when Shay came into my life and you know, she really put me on the right path and I did the same thing in life. I hired her life coach to help me with life, lifing it, everyone needs help with life. Um, when I started my podcast, we spun our wheels on that too, because I was like, I’m going to do it by myself.

Patricia Baxter (25:54):

I can figure it out and I could have hired somebody to do it for me. But, and I’m not saying you need to spend money. You can find a mentor. You can find somebody who’s walked your path. If you see somebody doing what you want to do, you don’t always have to reinvent the wheel. I would reach out, find somebody who’s already done that that’s willing to take you on and teach you. It is so much more beneficial to talk to somebody who’s already worked out the kinks then to try just to do it yourself. That was my biggest mistake. If you find yourself, spinning your wheels, stop, pause, find somebody who’s already done it. Whether that’s hiring somebody or just getting a mentor. That that was the key for breaking through those brick walls for me.

Robert Hanna (26:38):

Yeah, absolutely. And obviously you have achieved a lot within the profession for you. What makes a great lawyer?

Patricia Baxter (26:45):

I think somebody who really listens to what their client wants, I have clients that want to try cases and I have clients that want to shut down cases very quickly. It is creating a true partnership and collaboration with your clients, listening to them, listening to their business reasons for doing X, Y, and Z, getting to know their risk tolerance. You got to know the law, but every, all the lawyers know the law, like most lawyers I know can take a DEP and, and write discovery, write motions. But the ones that really, really separate themselves from the pack are the ones that have those relationships, where they’re really attuned to what their clients want. It’s not about the point ones or the billing. It’s about alright,do they want me to shut this case down and why what’s, what’s their risk tolerance here? Let me listen to what they have done in the past, what they’re saying and create that relationship. That’s, that’s my personal experience. My longtime clients, I actually consider their friends of mine. And I joked with one last week when he was like, if you do that again, I’m going to fire you. I’m like, if, if you fire me, we are still going to be friends, so don’t worry about it. So I think that’s really the key is if you’re somebody who has clients, I assume lawyers, most lawyers do is to really be a great listener and collaborator.

Robert Hanna (28:03):

Yeah. I love that. And just finally, maybe to build on that point, then what’s your key piece of advice in relation to getting clarity in your GL files?

Patricia Baxter (28:13):

I think you have to do a deep dive. You really have to do a deep dive in your, in your venue, what venue you’re, in what facts you are gathering as much information as you possibly can. And once you do that and sift through it, answers come to you. It’s not that difficult to do. It’s just getting past your own mindset that you have to have all the information that you have to be perfect, um, that you have to turn over every stone and cross every T and dot every I. You don’t, you’ve just got to get over yourself and take the leap and make some calls and your clients will appreciate it.

Robert Hanna (28:46):

Yeah. And you talked about it earlier at the beginning of the podcast, about your days and your time and percentages, because you know, you are senior in terms of managing partner, you are doing all this extra work, you know, how do you manage to sort of record, edit videos on top of everything else you’re doing? What’s your, your time management strategy?

Patricia Baxter (29:04):

So I pick things that are something I can repurpose, which I know that you know how to do. Like we’ll repurpose this podcast into clips and maybe we’ll take the transcript and do some stuff with it, with the transcript. But I, I tend to think, all right, if I’m going to do a podcast, then my editor is going to take care of editing the clips. And you know, I don’t have to do that. I don’t edit my videos and nor would you want me editing or my videos, I don’t have that skill set. That’s what I do. I don’t do webinars unless they’re recorded. I don’t write, uh, this book that I wrote will probably be turned into it’s own podcast at some point or repurposed in some way, the book has been repurposed in my post. So that’s the key for me, evergreen content that lasts a long time that I can repurpose and reuse and that doesn’t just go away in the smoke. So that’s the key to time management for me, I could do two podcast film, two podcasts a month and get five to six pieces of content out of it. So I’m not necessarily worrying about creating new things constantly. It’s what can I get from that hour of time? That’s the best way, versus just constantly creating original new stuff. That’s my key.

Robert Hanna (30:19):

Yeah and I guess to put it into the legal world, you think about a case there’s a million different ways you can approach a case, right? And you can think about a case it’s similar with your content. There’s various different ways you can use to repurpose it. You can go and speak at a live event, but if that’s not recorded and after that live event that is done, whereas actually all these online things and everything you do, there’s so many different ways. You can continue to communicate with your audience and you’re doing a great job of that. So if people want to follow or get in touch with you about anything we’ve discussed today, what is the best way and platform for them to do that? Feel free to shout out any web links or your best social media channels. And we will share them with this episode for you too.

Patricia Baxter (30:58):

So yes, LinkedIn, Patricia Baxter. I, you can search me. I’m there. You can check out my book @sixtydaystoclarity.com. It is a free ebook on that site. It’s also on Amazon. If you want to pay for the paperback hard copy version, but that’s it. Uh, LinkedIn is where I’m at. Most of my days, you can find me there. I will respond

Robert Hanna (31:19):

Great stuff. Well, thanks. A million Patricia. It has been such a pleasure. Finally, having you on the Legally Speaking Podcast,

Patricia Baxter (31:27):

I’m such a fan of yours.

Robert Hanna (31:29):

The journey of yours is truly inspiring. So from all of us on the Legally Speaking Podcast, wishing you lots of continued success, but for now over and out.

Robert Hanna (31:37):

This week’s review comes from Josh 9 9 1 1 5 5. Josh says great podcast. This is a really informative and enjoyable to listen to show. I strongly recommend that anyone going into the legal profession. Thank you so so much, Josh. We really appreciate your kind words and support. It means the world to all of us here on the Legally Speaking Podcast. Thank you for listening to this episode of the legally speaking podcast. If you enjoyed the show and want to help support us, remember to leave us a rating and review on Apple iTunes. You can also support the show and gain exclusive benefits, bonus content, and much more by signing up to our Patreon page, which is www.patreon.com/legallyspeakingpodcast. Thanks for listening.