Legally On the Move: Careers, Tech & Insights from Dubai – Josh Smith – E18

You can hear Rob and Josh discussing:

– Dubai as a Launchpad for Legal Career Transformation

– A Thriving Legal Ecosystem Amid a Massive Influx of Talent

– Cultural Diversity and How it Enhances Workplace Perspective

– A Behind-the-Scenes Glimpse on Legal Tech in Dubai with Josh

– The Importance of Local Nuance and Networking

Connect with Josh here – https://theorg.com/org/falconlion/org-chart/josh-smith

Transcript

00:00

Welcome to legally on the move careers tech and insights from Dubai in this exclusive mini-series of the legally speaking podcast we’re taking you to the heart of Dubai a global hub for legal innovation cutting-edge technology and transformative career opportunities here’s what you’ll gain career inspiration unlock the secrets to thriving in Dubai’s dynamic legal market tech trends dive into how AI blockchain and legal tech are reshaping the industry diversity and leadership here from trailblazersis driving inclusivity and innovation in the UAE and Global Perspectives explore how Dubai’s unique blend of tradition and ambition is creating a thriving legal ecosystem.

00:40

Recorded in iconic locations, these episodes bring you the energy and insights of one of the world’s most exciting legal hubs.

00:48

Don’t just listen, experience the future of law.

00:50

Ready to move forward with us?

00:52

Let’s go.

00:53

So, welcome to the Legally Speaking podcast.

00:56

Name, title and organisation.

00:58

Yes, I’m Josh Smith.

01:00

I’m a senior lawyer at Yas Holding in Abu Dhabi here in the UAE.

01:04

I also do a fair few things on the side, so quite a difficult and tricky and random.

01:09

legal career but yeah excited to see you again Rob.

01:12

Well a very keen networker and very well established here in terms of the legal scene that’s why we’re keen to get you on the show today but let’s get into it let’s talk about your career journey what inspired you to pursue a career in Dubai and how does it compare to other global markets in your opinion?

01:26

Yes I trained in London and to be honest just wanted to mix it up a little bit my wife actually grew up in Dubai so when we were looking at where to goyou’re asking all the different questions of all the places people do go like Cayman, Bermuda, all these fun places and then to be honest our family were here, it made more sense, I like Dubai and came out here and to honest it’s been great and actually the best thing about it was I was in a bit of an area where I wanted to pivot a little bit, do something different with my legal career, came out here and Dubai is great for that so I’m glad that I’ve moved here over anywhere else.

02:01

Do you feel like there’smore opportunity here versus other places or less opportunity?

02:07

I think it depends.

02:08

I think it’s a little bit harder here than perhaps meets the eye.

02:11

I think obviously, you know, look, it’s really connected here.

02:15

There’s a lot of industry here.

02:16

Whether there’s as many jobs as meets the eye, I don’t know.

02:19

Whether it’s as difficult or as easy as people think, actually, I’m not too sure.

02:23

But one thing I would say is there’s just so many people coming here.

02:27

And I think with that,When you compare to other markets, I think there’s going to be more and more opportunity constantly.

02:35

I chat to so many people, I help businesses that try to enter into the UAE.

02:40

So many of them are Brits and every other person you chat to wants to end up in Dubai.

02:44

So there’s more and more people coming here, there’s going to be more and more opportunities.

02:48

And everyone you chat to seems to have a side hustle.

02:50

So you’ve always got that.

02:52

when you chat to people.

02:53

Yeah, and that’s something I know you’re passionate about as well.

02:55

Let’s talk about workplace culture though, again, for people who may be less familiar with Dubai, you know, how does its mix of this ambition and obviously influence that it has on the world, sort of the steps that are being taken to promote inclusivity with all these, you know, different cultures and different backgrounds?

03:10

I think Dubai and UAE generally has just been really quite far ahead when it comes to inclusivity.

03:16

I think mainly, you know, there’s so many more expats than there are locals.

03:20

And there’s people from so many different cultures.

03:23

So with that, naturally organisations have to just bear in mind all the different cultural nuances, cultural norms and are really, really embracing of that.

03:32

So I think it really does lead in that respect.

03:35

And I think also,Tobai in particular, the UAE is very astute at trying to position itself globally.

03:42

And so as a result, it’s trying to make sure it’s attracting talent, it’s attracting people, it’s doing the right things.

03:48

I think the government do a wonderful job of trying to approach expansion and what to do in different industries.

03:53

And so all the businesses here follow that.

03:55

So I think it’s really a good place in terms of inclusivity.

03:59

In terms of all the different cultures you’ll come into contact with, I mean, look, when I was in the UK, obviously we say it’s a melting pot and everything, butat times it doesn’t seem that much of A melting pot, whereas here, you know, you think, all right, I’m one of, you know, my company, for example, I’m one of the few, I think I’m actually the only British person there.

04:16

Yeah.

04:16

So, you know, that’s different.

04:18

And there’s people from all over.

04:19

And that really makes you think differently and humbles you and makes you appreciate other cultures a lot as well, which I think is really exciting, especially when you’reat this sort of mid-level of your career.

04:28

Yeah, I think you’re around so much diversity of thought, which is only going to help expand your mind, you’re going to grow, and so much positives are going to come from that.

04:35

One thing we can’t avoid, obviously talking about, is technology.

04:39

So how is tech, like AI blockchain, driving change in Dubai’s legal sector, and what innovations are making the biggest impact?

04:47

I think, to be honest, I think it’s still maybe a little bit slower than might be expected.

04:55

I think, you know, there’s still ways to come.

04:56

That’s certainly been my experience, you know, chatting to different people.

05:00

I think the one thing I would say is UAE on a whole is really advanced technologically wise.

05:07

and is really trying to techify everything.

05:09

You look at when you’re a resident here and the apps you have to have and how everything’s linked to your ID, it blows the UK away.

05:16

So it’s got that mindset behind trying to solve solutions.

05:20

I think in the legal industry, it’s still moving towards it.

05:24

I think AI is probably the main thing that gets people talking and gets people curious because that’s the main thing we’re talking about in tech right now.

05:32

And I think they’re trying to go, well, let’s go a bit further, let’s go for the more complex, theinteresting technological solutions, which I think is probably the right way to go because you don’t need to techify everything.

05:45

But I think certainly this year we’re gonna see a big big change.

05:48

When I think back to a couple of years ago it felt like in legal tech there was still some ways to go, but you could have said that anywhere.

05:55

Now I think people are thinking no there’s so much industry here, there’s so much potential, so much talent here, it makes a lot of sense to try and bring your product, your solution here.

06:05

And I think local organizations and businessesis recognize that might help them and that’s the point of tech, right?

06:11

It’s trying to make lives easier, trying to make things work better.

06:14

Yeah, absolutely, smarter not harder and all of that good stuff.

06:17

Okay, what’s your vision for the future of Dubai then?

06:19

What are the bold predictions you see in terms of legal landscape here and how’s that going to evolve over the coming years?

06:26

I actually do think the tech side of things is going to really kick off.

06:31

When you chat to a lot of people, when I chat to a lot of people, on my experience, I think it feels like that is maybe a little bit further than meets the eye, but it is coming, and I think very soon it’s going to happen in a really big way.

06:43

You’re going to see a lot of leading legal tech businesses here, doing a lot here.

06:49

I think the local legal tech industry will also emerge, because they’re really good about startups here, they’re really good about embracing tech, professional services.

06:58

I think it’s going to boomreally quite quickly.

07:02

So I think that’ll be the main change.

07:04

I think to be honest, what will continue to happen is just the influx of expats from everywhere.

07:10

I think we’re going to see so many more Brits in particular.

07:15

And I think obviously that might change things and how legal teams work, etc.

07:19

But I think Dubai’s already in particular way ahead of a lot of places.

07:24

Abu Dhabi’s way ahead.

07:26

So I don’t think there’s much that’s going to change massively.

07:29

I think they’re just going to execute a bit better and put things together and just continue to go boom.

07:34

Yeah, and every time I keep coming back I just see change, progression, development and excitement.

07:40

What’s one thing before we wrap up that you know now that you wish you’d known before entering into themarket?

07:46

I think to be honest I was quite humbled in terms of the actual work I ended up doing.

07:50

I came here thinking well I’ve done this, I’ve done that, I’ll be able to do that anywhere and what I failed to appreciate was a lot of the local nuance in business transactions and law in particular.

08:04

I think I was humbled quite quickly and it was really good for me and I’d really recommend moving somewhere like here for that reason because it made me think well there’s a lot of cross-cultural business differences.

08:13

It really opened my eyesIt really made me a better lawyer, to be honest.

08:17

So I think I probably should have been a bit more prepared for that.

08:21

And maybe that would be to hit the ground running a little bit quicker.

08:25

But I think that’s the name of the game moving.

08:27

There’s so many adjustments, so many things to change.

08:29

I think working for the right organisations and knowing the right networks is really key here.

08:36

That’s one thing I would say.

08:37

I was quite fortunate with my father-in-law.

08:39

being established here, knowing people, it was a bit easier to network.

08:43

So definitely come here, meet people, try and figure out who are the right people to meet and do your research and then I think Dubai and the UAE is just a great place.

08:52

I think you’re a great blueprint for networking.

08:55

When I came over the recent trip, we got together, shared ideas, you’re creating ideas, you’re building relationships, you’re advancing your own career as well.

09:03

It’s been great Josh, I’m sure our listeners are going to want to know more about you, so if they do, what’s the best place for them to find you?

09:09

Is there a LinkedIn, is there any social media handles, websites you want to shout out?

09:12

Yeah, I mean, I’m on LinkedIn, it’s just Josh Ham Smith, Josh Hamilton Smith.

09:17

You know, reach out, I’m forever, I do quite a lot of mentoring for junior lawyers, so junior lawyers looking for advice in the UK or here, happy to help.

09:25

Equity Businesses, looking for someone who’s an experienced alternative legal consultant.

09:30

I’ve operated in lots of different ways.

09:32

I’m always contactable, e-mail, LinkedIn, all that fun stuff.

09:35

So yeah, hit me up and always happy to chat, always happy to help where I can.

09:39

There we go.

09:40

Well, look, it’s been an absolute pleasure getting on the Legally Speaking podcast, but from now, from Dubai, live here, over and out.

09:45

Thank you so much for tuning in to this episode of our Legally on the Move from Dubai series.

09:51

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09:57

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09:58

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