On today’s Legally Speaking Podcast, I’m delighted to be joined by Emily Monastiriotis.

Emily is the Global Managing Partner at Simmons & Simmons. She specialises in international construction disputes and is a market-leading expert on fire safety cases. Her work has been recognised in the Lawyer Top Cases of 2024. Emily firmly believes in her three guiding principles – clients, people and technology. Earlier this year, she was named on of Financial News’ Top 50 Most Influential Lawyers 2025.

So why should you be listening in? 

You can hear Rob and Emily discussing:

– Emily’s Inspiring Path to Leadership

– How to Lead with Integrity

– Pioneering Innovation at Simmons & Simmons

– A Balancing Act: Emily Monastiriotis’ Secrets to Resilience

– Building a Creative Legal Culture

Connect with Emily Monastiriotis here – https://uk.linkedin.com/in/emily-monastiriotis

Transcript

Rob Hanna (00:01)

So a very big warm welcome to the show, Emily.

Emily Monastiriotis (00:04)

Thanks very much Rob, thank you for having me.

Rob Hanna (00:07)

it’s an absolute pleasure to have you on the show. And before we get into all the amazing things you have achieved in and around the world of law, we do have a customary icebreaker question here on the Legally Speaking podcast, which is on the scale of one to 10, with 10 being very real, what would you rate the hit TV series suits in terms of its reality of the law if you’ve seen it on the scale of one to 10?

Emily Monastiriotis (00:29)

Is there a minor scale?

Rob Hanna (00:31)

Yes, many

people have given it a very serious minus, so yes.

Emily Monastiriotis (00:34)

Yeah, I mean,

as much I’d like to think that there’s lots of glamour that comes with the role, and don’t get me wrong, it’s a great role to have. I’m not quite sure that I could ever describe Suits as being realistic, but it’s fun to watch. It’s good TV. Yeah.

Rob Hanna (00:46)

There we go. You can give it a minus a lot. And with that, we’ll

move swiftly on to talk all about you. to begin with, Emily, would you mind telling our listeners a bit about your background and career journey?

Emily Monastiriotis (00:55)

Yeah, sure.

So I come from, I suppose, a of a different background. My mum’s actually the original Shirley Valentine. So my mum is English. My father’s Greek. And she left England in the late 60s and moved to Corfu, where my dad was a local waiter. And they fell in love, got married. I was literally born in the UK, I think, because my mum was too scared to give birth at a Greek hospital. But I moved back to Greece when I was six weeks old. I grew up, had, Rob, honestly, I had the most

amazing, amazing childhood. I grew up in a village in the south of Corfu, very, close to the beach. My parents were in the tourist industry, which is quite…

It’s quite a difficult life because you have to work five months of the year to then live for 12. I went to an amazing tiny, tiny primary school. There were 30 of us in the entire school. There were six in my entire year. So very sheltered, very happy childhood. I then went to Caulfield Hand for my last three years at school. And then in 95, I decided to take the big step and to move to the UK because I felt it was a whole part of me that I didn’t really know much about the English side.

Rob Hanna (01:38)

Hmm.

Emily Monastiriotis (02:06)

of our family. So I decided to move to the UK and I read English language and linguistics at Durham University. And I often talk about the year that my resilience was born and it was definitely 1995. You can just picture leaving Corfu, moved to Durham and actually I’ve just celebrated, don’t know if celebration is the right word, my 30th year actually in the UK because I moved to the UK I’d say 30 years ago, I moved to Durham, I didn’t know what fish and chips were, it was quite an unusual year for me.

Rob Hanna (02:20)

Yeah.

Emily Monastiriotis (02:36)

And I basically kind of ever since then lived in the UK. I read English language because I really, really want to improve my academic English. school that I went to, I was totally taught in Greek, but I was brought up thanks to my mum at bilingual. I then kind of read, I did a law conversion course, did an LPC. I trained at a niche construction firm. I discovered pretty early on that I wanted to be a construction lawyer, which is always a great conversation killer.

Rob Hanna (03:02)

Yeah

Emily Monastiriotis (03:06)

what you do is say lawyer they get quite fascinated then we said construction or that used to usually kill the conversation. I’m not sure it’s got much better now that I was a managing partner of a law firm but anyway and then I yeah so I joined Simmons about 10 years ago best ever career move really for me so a bit of a kind of different background, potted history but I think just life just takes you where it does right you see opportunity and you go for it.

Rob Hanna (03:11)

Hahaha.

Absolutely. And we absolutely agree with that on the show and yeah, growing up in Cawthorn must have awful. Like you said, know, visions here of like places I need to go on holiday and that’s top on the list. And it’s funny that you joke about construction because my younger brother is a QS actually and in construction and so whenever he starts talking about things, it’s a conversation killer. So it took me when you referenced that. What drew you to law originally though? What inspired you to take the route to be a lawyer?

Emily Monastiriotis (03:58)

I’ve always wanted to be a lawyer. So know when people ask you that awkward question, if you weren’t a lawyer, what would you be? I literally, I have no genuine answer. have to make something up.

Rob Hanna (04:04)

Yeah.

Emily Monastiriotis (04:09)

It was one of these things that just really fascinated me. I imagine TV probably has quite a lot to answer for. I grew up in the LA law era. And I just remember thinking it was like a really interesting. For me, I wanted to move away from the village I was growing up in. I wanted to achieve a career somewhere. I thought law was pretty interesting. My mum, who’s a massive, massive hoarder, about three, two, three years ago, she discovered this note. And when I was seven, where I broke the effect that I want to be a lawyer because I like

Rob Hanna (04:18)

Yeah.

Emily Monastiriotis (04:39)

win arguments. I’m not quite sure what I thought at the time, but I just never ever considered any other career. I’m a pretty determined person and I decided pretty early on that’s what I wanted to do. It’s just how was I going to get there was a big question for me.

Rob Hanna (04:54)

Yeah, and you’ve absolutely got there. And yeah, it’s a tremendous achievements what you have gone on to do again to educate our listeners because we are interested in construction and construction disputes. You know, you specialize in international construction disputes and very much market leading expert on fire safety cases for our listeners who might be unfamiliar, which is sort of tell us a little bit more about your practice area and what it’s all about.

Emily Monastiriotis (05:16)

Yeah, so construction, the reason I wanted to do construction, just to start there, is because one of the, I had two main criteria. I didn’t want to do anything that had kind of that human element, family law, divorce. just, I just know my personality. I wanted to act for corporates. My second criteria was I wanted to do something that every case was different and had active law in it. And very much kind of construction was that thing for me. And because every single case is different and they all have quite

Rob Hanna (05:36)

Yeah.

Emily Monastiriotis (05:46)

strong

technical element to it. So I kind of trained, as I say, in a niche construction firm. really got into the international side of the business and did a lot of work in the Middle East, so large infrastructure projects. So why a project delayed, who’s responsible for delays, big defects, defects on projects. And I did quite a lot of negligence cases. that’s quite interesting, making a career out of other people’s mistakes. But as I kept saying to clients at the time, that is why you’re insured. That’s why you have PI insurance.

asking for architects, engineers, quantity surveyors, could tell your brother as well. And really kind of moving on to kind of larger international construction arbitration because I really wanted that kind of international element to my case. And obviously there were very, very tragic events in Grenfell in the UK. Fire safety became a real issue here, very difficult, legal environment, very difficult, REG environment for clients in the UK.

Rob Hanna (06:16)

Yep.

Yeah.

Hmm.

Emily Monastiriotis (06:46)

And it was one of those areas that you felt that you had to kind of really develop. So I led the fire safety team and here at Simmons acting for a number of large contractors in the UK, whilst also making sure I kind of maintain my international construction focus. I did some really fascinating projects around the world. think the worst one was probably a sewage treatment facility I had to do in the Middle East, but that was probably the less glamorous side of things. did a really great oil field dispute in Kuwait in the early 2000s.

and road projects, bridges, all types of large infrastructure projects and every case was different, every client was different and it was really really interesting.

Rob Hanna (07:28)

Yeah, and I was kind of leading to my next question really, because some of your cases and a lot of your cases obviously been featured in the lawyer top cases year after year. Is there one most memorable case to date that you can share with us? And if so, why?

Emily Monastiriotis (07:40)

Yeah, I mean, it’s difficult to pick one of them. think one of my… The case that I learned the most, if I could put it like that, was probably… It was the largest data center dispute at the time. And it was…

Data centers are now a really big area and a massive focus for us here at Simmons, but generally in the industry. And data centers started off many years ago, and this was the largest dispute in relation to a data center. And things like when you choose experts, it was very difficult because there wasn’t any expert who’d given evidence on data centers. So we had to spend quite a lot of time interviewing different technical people because choosing experts for construction cases is an art in itself because you’ve to

someone who has deep technical expertise but who can then explain the very complicated technical issues to the lawyers and ultimately to the judge or the arbitrator. it was a really interesting case. It was also quite a difficult case in that we had Covid at the time and the hearing, was a lengthy hearing, was straight after lockdown and it was strange coming back into the city and being in rooms together. So we had to

to kind of work and be very, very flexible during lockdown. It was, had an international dimension. The lawyers from the other side were based in Asia. We were based in the UK. So there lots of kind of practical issues there, but it was one of those cases where I look back and we had such a great team. The team here at Simmons were fantastic. The barristers that we worked with, the experts, but none of it was easy. It was all had to be pulled together. And I think it was the case where I genuinely think I learned much more

about any other area, but also you learned about what good teamwork really looked like. it was actually, I’m sure we’ll come on to speak about AI, because everyone speaks about AI. was like one of those moments where I really, really realized how AI and tech is changing the legal world. And it really, there was this incident that happened which really kind of changed my mind shift. So I’ve got many fond memories, many difficult memories. It ruined quite a lot of holidays that.

Rob Hanna (09:37)

You

Yep.

Emily Monastiriotis (09:56)

a lot of calls at insatiable hours but that’s the reality of being construction litigator working across time zones but for me it was kind of the one case that really stands out in my career.

Rob Hanna (10:07)

Yeah. And just as you were articulating that I could see how you, I talk a lot about skill stacking actually from experiences that you get involved in and just how you articulate everything involved, those sort of skills or those experiences that you can pick up just from that one case that you can then move forwards. And, know, it’s just tremendous the work that you’ve done. And again, that leads nicely to what I was going to talk about. You, touched on resilience before, you know, I always talk a lot about, look, tough times don’t last, but tough people.

1. And again, I love that you’ve reframed that in terms of teamwork through advocates of teamwork. We is greater than me. Absolutely. But as someone who has been sort leading international disputes, super high profile matters, how do you manage the pressure, but ensure that you remain effective at the moment of most complexity?

Emily Monastiriotis (10:49)

Yeah, I I’ll need to work out whether I remain effective.

what works for me and my resilience. I first things first, I’m one of these people that I’m very good at compartmentalizing. And I also, I recognize my own limitations and I know my own limitations. And I have to remind myself, I am one person and I can only do what I can do. I know my signs. I know what I need to do to remain healthy, to remain resilient and to really kind of focus my own mind. And I think a lot of it is about really understanding

Rob Hanna (10:57)

Yeah.

Emily Monastiriotis (11:25)

yourself, your limitations and your opportunities. And we talk about, I mean, like you’re in a high-pressured environment, right? At Simmons, it’s high performance but supportive cultures. I often talk about that. But it is a very, very high-performance environment. ⁓

and to get the best out of your people you need to make sure that you understand them as individuals but to do that you really need to understand what works for you and for me things like making sure that I exercise regularly, that I have downtime with the kids at the weekend, family holidays, there’s things that I know that I need to do to make myself resilient and but as I say for me the key is recognizing my own what it is I need to do and really making sure that I try and find time to do so because

is time doesn’t exist, does it? You have to make time. You have to work out how can you make time in a pretty busy, high-performance world.

Rob Hanna (12:11)

No.

And I couldn’t agree more. on the health point, I made a conscientious

decision this year to ensure that I run. so a lot of people who follow me and follow the show, I’ve been running 5k every work day and I keep it in my calendar. It’s in a fixed time. So, or I find a time. once it’s written down, I have the time block to ensure that I can commit to that. And actually I try to run before every podcast episode so I can bring my best, you know, hopefully the endorphins and actually we’re a little bit delayed coming on today, which allowed me to actually get my run in. So I’m super excited and like really happy I got to do that. So hopefully I can perform well for you today and talking of performing you became

global managing partner of Simmons and Simmons, took office, think, as first of May of the year, you started the role. So what does a typical day look like for you? Assuming no two days are the same, but give us a tip.

Emily Monastiriotis (13:04)

yet. But that’s why I wanted this role Rob, because no two days are ever the same. really, honestly, can’t in the past six months have been phenomenal. I feel so privileged to do what I do and I love what I do. But there are no typical days. But that is what I like about it.

Rob Hanna (13:09)

Yeah.

Emily Monastiriotis (13:21)

I’ve spent a lot of time traveling actually because as you said, it’s kind of a global role. One of the first things I did is I appointed our first ever UK country head in the phenomenal Penny Miller, who’s one of my great, great colleagues here, because I really wanted the UK to have its own kind of identity, push forward. We’ve got some really exciting opportunities in the UK. We’re moving building, we’re developing. We’ve got great client relationships here in the UK and I wanted the UK to be really kind of well looked after, but I wanted my

Rob Hanna (13:27)

Yeah.

Emily Monastiriotis (13:51)

to be on the international side of the business because I think that for me is one of our differentiators in the market, kind of our global network. coming back to the case I was talking about earlier, the data centers case, there’s nothing like teamwork and getting to know people as people. And for me, it’s been very, very important to be traveling around all of our offices. I’ve tried to get around all of them via Christmas, which is no mean feat.

Rob Hanna (14:09)

Yeah.

get around to the five minutes which is the day you get to

news.

Emily Monastiriotis (14:19)

international offices and we have and there’s nothing like spending time and with with people in the various offices seeing clients in different offices. Obviously I kind of chair our exco, so chairing the exco is something that I have to do on a regular basis. We have a very clear sector focus at Stinman, so chairing meetings with our sect heads, but spending time with people like I see my role is getting the best out of the amazing talent we have at the firm and the only way you can do that is really getting to

the people.

Rob Hanna (14:50)

Yeah,

and that shows you genuinely care as well investing that time rather than just being a number and just putting in the available hours, you genuinely care about their development, their well being, what they’re trying to achieve out of a career of being a lawyer. And clearly, that’s what sets you apart as one of the top top legal leaders in the UK. Okay, so you are responsible building on that.

for basically developing the firm, driving its vision, its business plan. We talk a lot about the importance of being mission focused in terms of having a company or a firm to really get people to understand their contribution, how it delivers on that and why it’s important. Ours on the own show is to inspire legal minds and transform legal futures, hopefully with the content we produce. But what do you hope to achieve and what is your vision for the firm?

Emily Monastiriotis (15:28)

Yeah, I think for me kind of focusing on our areas of strength and really, and if you think about kind of our global footprint, I’m a really big believer in our Asia part of the business and really focusing where I see opportunities for us where the law firms are pulling out because that’s leaving a gap in the market that we can very readily kind of step into. So I’ve literally just come back from Singapore and Tokyo and I’m planning to, well, I’m not planning, I’m going to Hong Kong and to China very soon. So I’ve got a

really kind of clear focus and a very clear vision for the Asia part of our business, strengthening the Middle East. We’ve been in the Middle East for 30 years now. We’ve opened our doors in Riyadh and we have our launch event coming up. We’ve announced that we’re opening the free zone in Abu Dhabi, so the ADGM. So we’re targeting opening there later on in the year and then really strengthening our continental Europe offering. So for me, it’s really kind of building on areas of strength. I’m not interested in putting a flag in every single country.

I’m not interested in having kind of a two-person team somewhere. What I’m really keen is to really focus on our sectors. We’re well known for that work for financial institutions, asset management and investment funds, health and life sciences, TMT clients, and also energy, natural resources, infrastructure and construction. We live in an acronym here, it’s called ENRIG, so I don’t have to wheel that out every time.

I internally, but I just want my clients think about Simmons. I think it’s really important to know the areas that we’re really focusing on where we can give really deep sector expertise and make sure that we’re building that out.

Rob Hanna (17:07)

I

love that laser focus. And again, my listeners will be sick and tired of me saying it, but specific is terrific. The more you can be focused in on where you’re delivering and communicating to your clients and getting client centered, you will absolutely remain top of mind. You’ll continue trust those relationships will build. And I love that you also have a focus on the, the middle East. We were out there earlier this year and did a whole series in Dubai, which was lots of fun. Folks can go and check that out. I’ll leave you on the move. And we’re also doing a podcast and paddle tournament in January 26th. If anyone’s interested in once get in touch, get in touch.

with the show. talking back, going back to leadership, because you joined Simmons, I think in 2017, and now obviously the global managing partner, that’s just huge success in its own rights. But what are some of the key lessons from that journey that you could share with others looking to grow into leadership roles?

Emily Monastiriotis (17:52)

It’s interesting because genuinely I still have to pinch myself every day. I saw my email the other day and it made me jump. said, oh no, no, that is me. But I’ve always seen kind of everything I’ve done in my career as a stepping stone to the next thing in terms of training with a niche construction firm, work for a more international firm. So when I joined Simmons in 2017, I was made head of insurance and construction in the UK. I was then made head of UK dispute resolution.

Rob Hanna (17:55)

Yeah

Yep.

Emily Monastiriotis (18:22)

an amazing role while I international head of dispute resolution, where I really kind of realised how passionate I was about the international side of the business and then I was elected managing partner. So if you think about it, kind of a journey that’s kind of moved and as I say everything kind of been a stepping stone. For me,

one of the really important things is kind of stretching kind of what I talk about the kind of the boundaries of my zone. I never want to be totally outside my comfort zone where I feel I don’t know what I’m doing, but kind of constantly pushing myself, challenging myself, working out what is the next thing, what is it I want to achieve. I never ever, if someone said to me 10 years ago, you’ll be the global managing partner at Simmons and Simmons, I literally, I just wasn’t one of those things. But when the opportunity came, I got myself comfortable that I’d rather go for

Rob Hanna (18:43)

Thank

Yep.

Emily Monastiriotis (19:11)

and not get it rather than not try out. But then the more I got into the kind of election and the race, the more I wanted it. So it became kind of this almost existential issue for me. it all ended well, so was all good. But you learn a lot about yourself as part of a journey like that.

Rob Hanna (19:31)

Yeah. And encourage is a, I always encourage people with a growth mindset. No, what if it goes wrong? What is, what is rather than what is, what is the opportunity? Actually, if it goes right, become global managing partner of a top law firm. You know, I put my hat in the ring and I go for it. And I love that you talked about sort of, know, cause a mind stretch never returns. If you stretch that mind, you keep pushing yourselves. You’ll continue to grow such, such important advice. And look, the comfort zone is great, but nothing ever grows there. So we continue to challenge yourselves and talking of challenges, let’s talk about some of the leadership challenges. It’s all been rosy so far.

and it all looks amazing, but obviously trying to achieve things, can be quite hard along the way. So what have been some of the challenges and obstacles you faced in your journey to becoming managing partner and how did you overcome them? And perhaps what have been some of your lessons.

Emily Monastiriotis (20:13)

Yeah, I mean, as I say, it’s interesting as it comes back to the point I was making earlier, there’s only one person, but it’s very much kind of a leadership position rather than a management position, kind of inspiring the partners, setting the strategy, pulling people along the way. Affecting change in law firms isn’t easy. You do get people who are resistant to change and that’s understandable. I mean, I’m one of them finding change quite difficult, but one of the things that was very important to me when I was elected managing partner is that I didn’t want change for changes sake.

⁓ we’ve been pretty successful as a firm and very much kind of for me it’s about building on that success and just taking us to the next level, being more bold, being more ambitious, looking at kind of the opportunities that are available to us as a firm. I’ve tried to, what I’ve really tried to do in my first kind of six months is that balance between continuity but also change. And I sometimes recognize for some people the change that I’ve made have been probably a step too far.

enough and I just have to kind of work out the mood of the partnership, how far can I push people to push us in in the right direction. And it’s interesting that you when you put yourself up for a role like this you have to put your tin hat on at times because you do get direct feedback which is great.

Rob Hanna (21:20)

in the right direction. And it’s interesting, when you pick yourself up, overall, is you have to your tin hat on at times.

Emily Monastiriotis (21:30)

I’m here to learn. And so you do learn about yourself quite a lot. People give you feedback, whether it’s wanted or unwanted, but that is absolutely fine. And I think for me really, it’s just kind of, as I say, just getting the mood of the partnership, the mood of the people and pushing people in the right direction.

Rob Hanna (21:41)

And I think for me really it’s just getting the means of function.

Yeah. And I love that. look, the reality is nothing changes if nothing changes. And so you have to come in and make something happen. And ultimately you’ll find out as well, which, which have the people have the shared values, the shared vision. And, know, there’ll always be some change along the way, but certainly from the outside looking and everything you’ve done since we’ve been going into office has been absolutely fantastic. And it’s been a great success story. So, you know, wishing you lots of continued success. I want to double down on leadership.

because you are in a very high profile role. You rightly deserve the opportunity. So again, for other people that are looking to aspire and thinking about how they might need to develop, what leadership qualities do you think have been significant in your path to managing path?

Emily Monastiriotis (22:30)

Yeah, I mean, for me though.

team spirit. don’t know if that’s the leadership quality, but surrounding yourself with talent is, I’ve always had, I’ve always had the A-Team around me, which is very, very key. People talk about authenticity a lot, but I really think it’s one of those values that is so, so important in life. Being yourself, being kind of honest, truthful. Curiosity, for me, is always being kind of one of my driving principles, kind of always be curious, both about people

but about business and kind of striving to learn things. Honesty is very, very important. Integrity, I mean, you cannot be in a position of leadership unless you have integrity. For me, it’s kind of, again, one of the very strong guiding principles. But I do think that curiosity for me is the thing that I’ve developed over the years, kind of constantly thinking about how can I learn, how can I improve, who are the people that I can learn.

from who the people are that can bring on the journey with me and being very very curious I really think is what’s made a difference to me personally.

Rob Hanna (23:41)

Yeah. And I remember very, very early on before I set up my businesses and answered to me, Rob, you think you know everything, you know, literally nothing. And you always need to ensure you’re asking the right questions as well to get the quality information out of the people you’re trying to focus on. love that. Okay. We’re going to move into the techie AI bit. Of course we have to, but sort of leading into more AI. Let’s start with sort of your, client centric approach, because it’s very evident in your strategic focus and commitment to understanding clients needs.

What does strategic client focus look like, especially when technology is changing how clients define value.

Emily Monastiriotis (24:16)

Yeah.

I mean, we live in a very, very fast paced world. say changing nothing changes nothing. You can’t change nothing, right? Look what’s happening around you because you will be left behind. One of the things that I think really set Simmons apart is our innovative approach. We were the first law firm to acquire a regulated legal engineering arm back in 2019. it’s creating that kind of culture innovation and culture of tech. But it is more important than ever now to be really betting

Rob Hanna (24:23)

Yeah

Emily Monastiriotis (24:47)

down in client relationships and speaking to clients on how they are also transforming when it comes to the use of tech, to the use of AI, particularly generative AI, because we need to be part of that client journey. And that’s what we’ve been positioning ourselves to be doing for a number of years. And that’s actually one of the things that’s really fundamentally changing, I think, in law firms, which I think is actually quite exciting, and the skill sets that you now require to deliver client services.

I think about the kind of our legal engineers, our designers that we have at Simmons and how we’ve been pushing those boundaries for quite a few years now and how kind of really getting in and speaking with clients and helping them be part of their journey is really, really important because it is different. We look at kind of 10 years ago, it was all about kind of legal technical skills. And of course, of course you have to have top, top legal talent.

without a doubt, you’ve got to be top of your game when it comes to legal advice. now it’s a lot of the conversation is how do you deliver those services to clients as well in a more innovative way.

Rob Hanna (25:53)

Yeah, I couldn’t agree more. And earlier this year, we’re at the Festival of Entrepreneurs, which cuts across many industries, not just law and Piers Linney, who’s been on our show before, former Dragon’s Den investor, good friend of mine and lawyer, talks a lot about the value pyramid. It doesn’t matter if you’re a lawyer, it doesn’t matter if you’re an accountant, doesn’t matter even if you’re potentially a specialist in a certain area, you as a service provider need to find a way to out

the technology that is filling this pyramid. We’ve seen it at some sort of obviously lower levels with paralegal work, with contract review, et cetera, et cetera. Technology is only going to get better in the dial-up phase of this once in a species, not revolution opportunity of AI. So you need to find a way to ensure that human touch keeps client-centered, strategic, and add value. And I think that’s going to be the biggest challenge for a lot of organizations. And of course, you’re doing fantastically well in terms of embracing technology and AI and looking forwards and being early.

to it because I think as you say, the ship has left the harbor, people will be left behind. So let’s dive in a little bit more on some of the initiatives and sort of leveraging tech because you have spearheaded quite a few to leverage and enhance legal practice, embracing the firm’s development and adoption of AI. Can you tell us a bit more about some of the initiatives and the impact it’s had on Simmons and Simmons as a firm?

Emily Monastiriotis (27:02)

Yeah, now remember, ⁓

We were, I was at the International Executive Committee, sorry, I nearly fell into Simmons speak, the IEC, the International Executive Committee, a couple of years ago, where we met in Milan to try and decide whether or not we were going to buy a gen AI or build our own. And the benefit of hindsight, you don’t have the benefit of hindsight, you’ve got to make the decision in the main and work out where is our investment going to be. But again, we had a phenomenal team of partners who were advising us, our head of TMT, Alex Brown,

Rob Hanna (27:20)

Yep.

Emily Monastiriotis (27:34)

Drew Winlaw who joined us from Wavelength. had an amazing team of advisors where we decided that the right thing for us to do at the time was to build Percy our own in-house LLM. And it was absolutely, even now, benefit of hindsight, the right decision for us. Not least because it created that culture of innovation pretty early on and we’ve been helping kind of build Percy and roll it out to the rest of the firm. The fact that it’s kind of proprietary system,

of system, I really think differentiates us in the world because if we’re all using exactly the same tech in the same way, how do you differentiate yourself? for me, kind of that kind of curiosity, that innovation, the fact that we decide to do something different and that’s something that I again challenge myself constantly. I don’t want to do what everyone else does. I want us to be different. I want us to be innovative. I want us to be find creative ways of working with our clients.

And really kind of that was that that moment where it was I really think it was the right decision to make it felt the right time It’s proved to be the right decision person won an amazing award very recently We’re very proud and also it’s kind of I don’t know if you know the story But it’s called Percy because Simmons and Simmons were set up by twin brothers one of whom was Percy So I just think naming our LLM Percy just is a nod to our legacy the incredible history that Simmons has but also not innovation the future and kind

captures that really really well.

Rob Hanna (29:06)

I love that. And I love, love legacy and that story. And I love that when people are going left, you go right. And it’s something you’re talking my language too. And why the whole show was born. You know, we could have stayed a very vanilla legal recruiting business and just did what everyone else was doing, but we went out and built community and hopefully deliver value to people and, build brand and all of that good stuff. Okay. Let’s double down more on AI then, because you’ve been ahead of the curve as you reference when it comes to AI, what are your thoughts on how tech is shaping what clients expect today?

and how law firms must respond because I still think there’s hesitation by too many law firms.

Emily Monastiriotis (29:41)

Yeah, I mean, I don’t think it’s shaping. I think it’s revolutionizing services and fundamentally changing how you offer services to clients. I think those who don’t believe in AI or think it’s a hype or you speak to people that are the dot-com type bubble, think they’re going to be left behind.

Rob Hanna (29:46)

Yeah.

Yeah, yeah.

Emily Monastiriotis (30:04)

And I think

the world, the change is real and the change is happening here. And what I need to do is make sure that we’ve got an amazing team in-house that can help us kind of deliver those solutions. But the really, really interesting bit, I think, when it comes to AI and the point that we were discussing earlier around change at law firms is, yes, it’s got to be led by the front. Absolutely, I as managing partner, ultimately the buck stops with me and our leadership team and the senior people in this organization. But the thing that I think is really, really

brilliant about tech and AI is it gives juniors the opportunity to fundamentally change this firm because real change when it comes to tech and AI is going to come from juniors. It’s not going to come from people of my generation if I could put it like I’m so far behind. I’ve been spending kind of time in airport lounges learning more about agentic AI. Our team here pulled together some really great resources for me because I need to educate myself. I need to make sure I understand the technology and what it can deliver but it’s what is really

Rob Hanna (30:41)

Yeah.

Emily Monastiriotis (31:04)

really good is that gives juniors kind of that opportunity to really shape. And one of the things that we’ve done here at Simmons is we have what we call our AI champions, which are those people at the firm who can really go into every practice group, work out how we’re going to deliver different services to our clients and fundamentally shift how we deliver services and what are the types of technology that we need to invest in? What can we do with our current technology that revolutionizes and changes what we do with clients? And that is

the job of one, two people. really is. And I really genuinely

Rob Hanna (31:36)

Yeah.

Emily Monastiriotis (31:38)

believe that everyone at the organisation has got a role to play here. ⁓

Rob Hanna (31:42)

Yeah.

Emily Monastiriotis (31:43)

I was speaking to someone just in Singapore last week that come from a computer science background. You want people to have got those different skill sets. We’ve just launched our AI internship here in the UK, I think we’re the first law firm to offer that. And having kind of different people, different viewpoints and different skill sets is really important. people talk a lot, don’t they, about kind of, oh, what does it mean for junior lawyers? not going to be trained. I just think it’s such an exciting time to be a junior lawyer and bring something different to the

Rob Hanna (31:48)

Wow.

different people, different people, different girls, that’s really important. But I didn’t really talk a lot today about, kind of, what’s up. I didn’t really talk about the training. I didn’t really talk the training. didn’t the training. I didn’t really I

Emily Monastiriotis (32:13)

table.

Rob Hanna (32:14)

Couldn’t

agree more. And I love your approach to sort of diversity of thought. And I also encourage people and agree, particularly on the junior spectrum, to have a 360 board of personal mentors, people above you, people of same level, but also people beneath you more junior to because they have so much skills. I’m involved in some legal tech startups where I sit on the board. when they sort of, you know, the CEOs come in the young CEO, there’s so much wisdom and knowledge and skill set that I pick up learning from these people in a tech first world. And I think it’s exciting and we should encourage and

kind of empathize with these people to get that wisdom shared, because you can move further so much faster with those skills. Okay, you talked about Percy and this links nicely actually to there is risks, there’s safety, there’s governance when we need to think about AI. So what are some of the risks law firms face when adopting AI into their workflow without doing due diligence?

Emily Monastiriotis (33:04)

And I think, again, I have endless discussions about this because obviously hallucinations are a thing, right? Again, we spend a lot of time trying to make sure that person doesn’t hallucinate. But ultimately, when…

Rob Hanna (33:13)

Yeah.

Emily Monastiriotis (33:20)

you got work given to you by a paralegal, by a trainee, by a newly qualified. You always used to check it, right? So why now suddenly you think that just because tech is helping you produce something that you don’t need to check it? I just, I don’t understand how people think like that. And again, you’ve got a prompting how you prompt kind of gen AI and how you ask, ask for the source reference. It’s such an obvious thing. Ask it to do something and ask it to set out where the reference is. And then you go and check the reference. It’s no different to when

Rob Hanna (33:26)

Yeah.

Yeah.

Emily Monastiriotis (33:49)

you’ve

got someone to do and to do, I say, legal research in times come, but also really understanding the limitations of the technology and really using the right tools for the right type of task. think, and again, I’m going to speak about our AI champions. They’ve spent a lot of time creating really clear prompt libraries for our different parts of the business.

And it’s an education piece. it’s really, I also don’t subscribe to this notion that AI takes away critical thinking. If anything, need even more critical thinking now. And again, I just think I worried less about kind of the development of juniors and the development of kind of that.

Rob Hanna (34:19)

Mm. I just think I worry less about the development of genius.

Emily Monastiriotis (34:34)

AI is going to take away from critical thinking, if anything, you’ve got to be on the ball now. But you need to understand the technology and you need to understand its limitations. And it’s constantly moving the pace. Say, six months ago, it may have hallucinated if you prompted it in a certain way. It’s less likely to be now. And it’s just kind of constantly changing. So that’s why you have to be on top of your game when you’re looking at these things. And the other point to make, Rob, which I think is a really important one, is we’re not a tech company.

We are a law firm looking to help our clients deliver premium work for premium clients. That’s kind of one of the things constantly looking at solving our clients’ most complex problems. And AI helps us, but we’re not a tech company. And I think people sometimes forget about that, that our use of AI is to help deliver legal solutions to clients.

Rob Hanna (35:05)

Yeah.

Yeah, no, that’s a really important, important point. And, you know, the thing that I love about your approach is it’s looking forwards, not backwards. You know, you’re always looking about where we can improve, where we can get better. And ultimately it’s a tool, right? And every tool gets developed and improves like human as you go through your own skills, your own journey, you’re developing. These are continuously developing. So yes, you may need to go back and check it. And yes, maybe you should be checking it because like you say juniors, when they first started, you would check their works, but these tools will get better and better and better over time. So that time gap will be wrapped.

sort of reduce. then you’ll need to continue thinking about that value pyramid, how you can get up there, how you can keep adding that human touch, that value to your clients, to your people. I touched on mentoring, but I want to get your thoughts now, particularly around sort of talent and culture, because you’ve also championed mentoring, inclusion across the firm. What’s one thing you think law firms get wrong about talent and culture?

Emily Monastiriotis (36:15)

not treating people as individuals. But I think that’s really important because everyone makes assumptions like are people driven by money or driven by status or driven by…

Rob Hanna (36:18)

Okay. Love it.

Emily Monastiriotis (36:28)

people get driven by different things. And as I before, it’s like, how do we get the best out of our people? How do our people here at Simmons think, I love working at Simmons, I feel so supported, I’m reaching my own potential. And we can only do that if we understand the drivers of each people and treating people as individuals. I talk a lot to of partners here around kind of the notion of active management. And that is what I mean, I treat that person, I understand what it is that drives that person.

Rob Hanna (36:58)

Yeah, and I couldn’t agree more with that. And also, if people share personal information with you, which they’re happy for you to know, rather than did you have a good weekend? If they have a daughter say, how was your weekend with Jennifer? What did you get up to? Those little things of showing they’re not a number, but you know, and care about their life as well, I think is super, super important that you are. Yeah.

Emily Monastiriotis (37:15)

It’s also more interesting, it’s a much more interesting

question isn’t it?

Rob Hanna (37:18)

Yeah, exactly.

And you know, it’s important. So one thing you have set up and led is obviously the global mentoring programme at Simmons. So you tell us a bit more about that and how it’s benefited the professional development of each individual, as you say, if we’re looking at sort of really focusing on individuals.

Emily Monastiriotis (37:34)

Yeah, I mean, look back.

such a huge benefit of mentors around me, kind of those people.

that I looked to, I aspired to, I remember kind of being quite junior lawyer and meeting a partner who had young kids and just made up partner. I oh, okay, that’s good. A woman with kids can become a partner. I think, thankfully, that’s hopefully something that people don’t need to worry about in 2025. But back in 2002, it was a real kind of question of mine, how do you make it work? And also, as I say, I’ve benefited hugely from having mentors around me, those people I can go to. And now, I mean, people talk about leadership being lonely. One thing I don’t feel is lonely, because

I know who I need to go to and need to speak to. And for me, spearheading our global mentoring program is probably one of the most interesting roles I’ve ever had because, again, it’s around being a mentor is a responsibility and it’s great. And there’s lots of opportunities for people here to be given a mentor. But I also think it’s a really, really great opportunity for people to give back.

Rob Hanna (38:40)

Yeah. and I really believe that everyone, whatever role they’re doing, whatever services that they’re in, have got something to give to our nasty citizens because learning from each other, sharing an interview with each other…

Emily Monastiriotis (38:40)

other people and I really believe that everyone at whatever role they’re doing, whatever services that they’re in, have got something to give someone else at Simmons because learning from each other, showing an interest in each other

and supporting each other is really, key. And what I love about our mentoring program is it’s very, very tailored. So you go in and you say, what do you want the mentor for? it, I don’t know, because you want to develop your business development skills? Is it because you’re trying to work out how to be a parent and be a lawyer? Is it because

because you’re trying to kind of forge a slightly different path for yourself. So you want to speak to someone who’s had different roles of the firm and it’s very tailored and you then get given kind of three people to choose from and then you decide who the right person for you is. It’s a very, very tailored scheme. It’s not around having the same repetitive message but for the same for different people. And I think that is really kind of creating a culture of supporting each other because I say it’s really easy to say that we’re a high performance culture that’s supported. ⁓

actually mean in practice and I think kind of supporting each other, helping people reach their own ambitions is very, cool.

Rob Hanna (39:47)

Yeah, and I just love that approach and core value that you instill and you know, rising tide lifts all boats, doesn’t it? And I think it’s a great example of what you’ve been doing. Okay, question now maybe to make you think on the theta a little bit. Imagine there’s AI Emily interviewing you, not me. What’s one question you think we should ask you that would be valuable for our listeners that are pursuing a career in law or thinking about the next step in their legal career? What’s one question you think we should ask you that you would have wisdom to share?

Emily Monastiriotis (40:14)

Oh my god, what wisdom to share. I’m not sure I’ve got much of a…

Rob Hanna (40:16)

Yeah.

Emily Monastiriotis (40:17)

That totally, totally thrown me. Because you’ve asked me so many questions. I can’t really think about what was the one question you could have asked that you didn’t. I think the diversity of thought point that just explore that a little bit further because again, that’s something that I feel is so, important. And I suppose the question would be like, what skill sets do you think people need to have to be successful lawyers or successful in a professional environment? And I do think that kind of different

different people, different social backgrounds, different ethnic backgrounds, different gender, but also different skill sets. That diversity of thought piece, I think is going to become more and more and

And I think that’s pretty exciting when you’re a room with people who are all different, that’s when the real kind of creativity really kind of, I think, comes to life. So again, that kind of, that skill set point I feel so strongly about. But if you’re asking that question, I’m answering it in slightly different way.

Rob Hanna (41:18)

Yeah, no, I grew

No,

yeah, I totally agree. And I love that you keep sort of just giving us value. So I’m here for it. And I’ve loved the conversation start to finish time just flies by. And I guess I’ve got one final question, it’s kind of builds on what we’ve already shared. But anything else you would like to, to say specifically for the next generation of legal talent coming through, because you know, what the role of a lawyer will change, and he’s changing rapidly from, you know, my late grandfather, he set up his law firm in 1950s to what a modern lawyers doing now, there’s a little hell of a change in that time period. So what would be your advice?

young and inspiring lawyers coming into profession that want to make an impact.

Emily Monastiriotis (41:55)

think about how to differentiate yourself from the crowd. And I’ll tell you a really quick story. So I met someone recently who was struggling to get a training contract. And you could just tell they had this real spark in their eye.

I just couldn’t quite work out. I said, well, why don’t we just grab a quick coffee? Because I felt people have given time back for me and it’s my time to give time back to people. And I sat down with this person and they were great, but their CV was pretty bland. was like mooting, debating society, great grades, great university, did some pro bono work, did citizen as a vice bureau. And then right at the bottom of their CV, and it was a female, she was talking about being the cox for the men’s

team, rowing team at university. And I was like, that is so amazing. Why is this buried in your CV? Why in all the letters that you write to law firms, that’s not in there? Because that shows like, that shows leadership, it shows kind of, kind of team, how you pull a team together, the fact that you are the first female cox of a men’s first team at such a prestigious university. That is what you need to bring out. And she did then get a training contract. Now, did my advice help? Well,

Rob Hanna (42:49)

Yep.

Emily Monastiriotis (43:07)

it definitely didn’t hinder, but again, it’s how do you differentiate yourselves? Think constantly about what is it that you bring that’s different to everyone else?

Rob Hanna (43:09)

Yeah.

I love that advice. And I think your advice definitely did help. And I say to a lot of people, know, CV is not a describing document. It is a sales document. So if there’s things in there that really make you stand out, sell that to people in the right way. So you get that message across. Cause like you said, it’s a really good example of how you can differentiate yourself and sell yourself to, ⁓ to get ahead of others. ⁓ this has been a masterclass, Emily thoroughly, thoroughly enjoyed it. So if our listeners want to know more about.

you or indeed Simmons and Simmons, where can they go? Feel free to share any social media handles, any websites. We’ll also share them with this episode for you too.

Emily Monastiriotis (43:51)

Sorry, you cut out very quickly there.

Rob Hanna (43:53)

Any

websites or social media people would follow to get more information you would like to shout out?

Emily Monastiriotis (43:59)

Yeah, Simmons and Simmons LinkedIn, we’re pretty prolific on LinkedIn in all of our jurisdictions, in all of our offices. So yeah, if follow us on LinkedIn, that would be great.

Rob Hanna (44:11)

Awesome. All right. Thank you so, much, Emily. It’s been an absolute blast having you on the show from all of us here on the Legally Speaking Podcast!